turboplanner

4 minutes ago, Munger said:

...about that: From the Aircraft Noise Ombudsman (https://ano.gov.au/reportsstats/statistics/annual_report_2019_2020/AR2019-2020-attachments.asp)

That's what I warned you about Munger; suddenly information appears in publc which is not planning information, and you will finish up dealing with and emotional bushfire rather than an orderly planning process where the highest level decision-maker is the people's Tribunal.

...t. where the smell, entrapped in the snow for millions of years has been released by Global Warming.

The photo below shows the devastation caused to the Snobs Hill area of Hobart (in the foreground) cause by temperature rise.

"Another 1.4 degrees and we'll be buying nosepegs" said Bull, not really knowing what a nosepeg was, but thinking it had something to do with smell.

Yet it wasn't that long ago that the men in Hobart were forced to wear nosepegs by the wives, and "holding the strings" was a well used phrase down in the ...............

........set a precedent that CASA could not SL [AvRef] you as long as you ground looped before crashing.

This opened up a whole new sector of recreational aviation called Ground Loop Aerobatics for pilots who just want to fly, and the membership quickly expanded, albeit it was 200 steps forward and 10 steps back so to speak as the attrition rate grew ........

3 minutes ago, Flying Binghi said:

Just put up some wind power generators around the airport. Nobody will notice the aircraft noise then...🙉🤫

 

Forgot about them; they drive people nuts with their noise, would never be allowed in the cities.

1 hour ago, Old Koreelah said:

Another PITA for the nearby residents is reversing beepers; quite a few end up sounding pretty sick, possibly because they had stuff jammed into them.

They have improved in recent years, previously being audible from a couple of kiometres. The current ones make a hissing sound.

14 minutes ago, RFguy said:

putting aside exceeding VNE (spiral ?) , is there any spin recovery in IMC  taught at any level  ?

 Not in RA or PPL.

Anyone can hire an aerobatics instructor to give them some lessons in a suitable aerobatic aircraft.

Just now, Old Koreelah said:

What an excellent outcome, Turbs. Shows the value of opening a communication channel. I suspect most noise complains arise from only a portion of a particular activity.

My example: It beats me how anyone can tolerate, let alone listen to horse-race callers.

Yes, another example is at earthworks sites where tippers are coming in. People complain about the truck noise, but the noise which upsets them is the explosive sound of the huge tailgates as some drivers accelerate forwards and then slam their foot on the brakes to shake clay off the tailgate.

Just now, Munger said:

In your opinion, do we want a horizontal distance away from the aircraft or directly under the flight path at full noise take-off passing overhead? (That would be worst case scenario) We can always do a ground cruise run at a horizontal distance away from the aircraft (we know which one is the noisiest that frequents the airport).

The key thing is what the residents are (a) what the residents are actually hearing and (b) what, if anything is annoying them.

(a) Just to get an idea of what Lismore aircraft are producing, a horizontal reading from the nearest street to the runway for a take off with the engine WOT with the microphone in the centre of the closest lane to the houses (without getting bowled over. That noise should be reasonable consistent for the take off run to lift off when the additionl altitude extends the distance. (on a calm day).

Then some vertical readings under downwind, again the microphone on the closest point to the pattern (directly underneath)

Then vertical on the closest street under short final.

Then vertical on the closest street under take off. and maybe a couple of readings from streets slightly further out on the take off line to see how the noise diminishes.

That should be a good start to decide whether my comparison is going to be useful. I'd do both typical light aircraft and any Jet RPT, so in discussions you can differentiate from the two different Uses, (compare the light aircraft with legally allowed motor vehicles 24/7 and separate discussion on conditions for RPT using the Airservices Australia data, which may entails some curfew or runway departure action (similar to the new conditions on the helicopter of dropping down below the cliffs on the run up to the hospital to reduce noise.)

(b) can be very interesting. On one city speedway we were having trouble with one resident who had taken to phoning up the Council every meeting. The track had agreed to a 10:30 pm curfew, which produced a few no-result finals, and had tried mufflers, but interstate visitors arrived on the night with open exhausts. so one hot night I walked down the to resident's house with a noise meter. The family was sitting in the front garden having a few beers so I introduced myself and told them what I was doing, let them use the noise meter themselves, and they were inclined to agree that even sitting outside, the noise numbers were not excessive. Suddenly the husband opened up with "There, THAT"S what gets into my brain!" It was the aggressive commentator, several dB(A) higher than the cars, so we toned down the speaker system, and that ended the calls to the Council. We stayed in a caravan park for a week once near the Whitsundays and were woken every morning at 5 am by a 182 prop noise down the full length of the runway and over the top. That would be the sort of issue in this catergory, where it would fail the motor vehocle test, but something could be done about that aircraft, rather than affect the whole aircraft fleet including training.

39 minutes ago, Munger said:

That is a very interesting document! Is the reduction of noise by distance a known standard?

Yes, you should be able to find it without too much trouble. The achilles heel in my argument just yet is the analysis of the local aircraft noise during lockdown, but it does look promising. In the past I was able to use that argument to get speedways in some otherwise impossible places.

The main urgency atm is to get a submission in to Lismore Regional City Action Plan or you'll finish up the same as Kyneton with:

General Use Business Hub

Warehousing

Buildings 7 to 9 metres high (Rotors)

Noise limits done by non-aviation people

Community Hub (Ratepayer meetings, women, children, babies)

We're in lockdown so no airctraft flying and I couldn't complete this attachment, but a simple comparison with the traffic driving down the streets surrounding the airport will soon tell you of there is a noise issue or not.

Most of the Aircraft Noise standards are based on Jet RPT so are not representative of light aircraft training and use.

This attachment gives you a tool to measure against the 24/7 access to surrounding roads by car.

WX00159.docx

13 minutes ago, Flying Binghi said:

As an ‘how did we get to here from there’ backgrounder, the last 5 minutes may prove ‘educational’..🤔 .

A lot of what he was saying then put Australia and Victoria in a very good position compared to the rest of the word, but we've also had a massive learning curve since then and saved even more lives.

The last bit is proably a wish for a Communist State so a Leader could "tell us what to do".

1 hour ago, Old Koreelah said:

How old is that interview? 

About 90 years.

2 minutes ago, Paul davenport said:

No Flightrite I am not angry, but I am disappointed that so often these discussions deteriorate from what was a reasonable question to just plain waffle about anything . The question was ,I thought plain enough and I would have thought those with FIRST HAND information would have either told me yes it is possible this is what I did ,OR no this is what we have and it’s not possible under the current rules. I thank those of you that did enter the conversation in the spirit it was intended and ask those of you that didn’t to consider the worth of what you said in light of the original question. We seem to be discussing DOGS now so as far as I am concerned this topic is now closed 

You also don't seem to have understood the answers which apply to all four cylinder engines including Jabiru.

4 hours ago, onetrack said:

For some reason that I can't really fathom (apart from the old one trotted out regularly, "in line with International practices"), the dyes used to colour the various grades of ULP have been removed, starting 01/08/2021.

 

I don't see any real benefits from this decision, it was handy being able to ID fuel in jerrycans and drums, when its origin was unknown, or it wasn't marked. Does anyone agree with me that this decision is somewhat of a retrograde step?

 

https://www.aip.com.au/colour-australian-unleaded-petrol-grades-evolving-aip-technical-market-update

 

I was actually rather surprised to find that the colouring of ULP wasn't regulated previously, anyway, and could vary between oil companies, and between batches (obviously from different refineries).

 

https://www.mobil.com.au/en-au/our-fuels/faqs

 

I must have been using a lot of fuel from similar sources, as I didn't actually notice much variation in the colour, as Mobil indicates there was.

 

But it's very handy to have a different colour between octane levels, clarifying that the fuel you're trying to ID, is higher octane than the standard 91ULP.

 

What is interesting is that the low aromatics fuel (OPAL) for regulated inland communities, will continue to be dyed. I guess this is because they still haven't got control of petrol-sniffing.

 

 

 

We're in a changing world.

The colours for Petrol, Kerosene, Power Kerosene and Diesel distillate were very distinctive.

I haven't seen power kerosene in a long time but "Home" kerosene has been a distinctive blue in recent times.

Petrol seems to be becoming a lottery, depending on where the distributor buys its fuel, and maybe there's some spot market chasing going on causing rough petrol to show up at the pumps without colour.

8 minutes ago, pmccarthy said:

As a young pilot I couldn't afford to hire a Cherokee by myself. I had to find two or three friends to contribute to the cost, so I had to find a reason for the flight. Seeing the floods. Going to the lakes for a picnic. Etcetera. Ultralights, or more generally AUF then RAA planes, made flying affordable. I think FB has tongue in cheek.

Or he's trying to tell us that we were given exemptions from those high costs under certain conditions, and we don't need to be mucking up if we want to keep our exemptions.

1 hour ago, jackc said:

I won’t chuck  anyone under the bus, but a certain person in the regulatory hierarchy told me that crash investigation are not always very complete and when the Coroner sees the words ‘experimental’ or ‘amateur built’ aircraft they make a blame free finding, its then up to any party should they desire……to take civil action.

I will NEVER carry a PAX and only fly off remote airstrips.  The only person that can ever suffer from an aircraft crash is ME, live or die……..

The Coroner's fuction is just to find the cause of death, which is why we miss out on a lot of information on RA crashes compared to ATSB which covers the reasons as well. There wouldn't be a lot of point in what the certain person says, because if someone is injured by an out of control aircraft they or their friends will find a way to a public liability lawyer who will run the case.

However, life should be a lot simpler than than, it's just a matter of finishing the RPC, getting the L1, and enjoying flying.

1 hour ago, jackc said:

WHY do I need any damn certificate at all?  

Because you don't have a leg to stand on if you hurt someone, and you impact the whole RA sector, Simple as that.

A mirror mounted at an angle?

......and with the Moderator's stroke of the lash he was gone.

Cappy and Turbo were quite happy to get him off their backs but then Turbo needed to know the ring clearance fir a TEA35 Fergy, and Cappy wanted to know how to change a tyre, and they both became all tearful and turned on the ...................

......slated for the first audit by the new group, who knew every trick in the book because there were all of questionable lineage and charcter.

Cappy,  who had bought a dark grey blazer and had his name embroidered on it and been to Officeworks, to get a Clipboard, writing pad, notebook, six felt pens and assortment of stickers saying things like "do not use", "danger" "blindness" and bought himeself a Utility Belt with clips to hand all these items on, and at the last minute a baton, which now hung proudly. With his Helmet style hard hat he looked somewhat like a SWAT Team Member except for he eyes.

His Gaze fell on OT who was rebuilding a D7 (or it could have been a D8) and he .................................

1 hour ago, aro said:

There are states creating weird laws around vaccinations and masks, but I think all states have higher rates than Australia e.g. Alabama is 35% fully vaccinated, 45% at least 1 dose. Mississippi is the lowest at 41.9% at least 1 dose. Australia is 44.7% 1 dose 23.1% fully vaccinated BUT that is people above 16 years, I think the US data is all people.

You're right, all are on the move. Johns Hopkins University of Medicine current figures. - average vaccinated = 50.84%

24 minutes ago, danny_galaga said:

I understand your sentiment, but in reality, even the most hick states in the US have double the vaccination rates of Australia. 

There are still complete No-Vaxx States; I think Alabama might be one.

The reason for the US higher vaccination to date was that they couldn't co-ordinate the separation distance+masks+hand sanitation+ contact tracing+14 day isolation which we developed and given us a fraction of the deaths per 100,000 so they went with emergency approved vaccination as the control whereas in Australia its a secondary measure designed to open up travel and business next year.

.....the no win no fee group, who kept asking for their money back, which ........

Since Cappy has let the cat out of the bag and exposed Agent X, respondents should feel free to continue incognito or exposed.

....Turbine Immediate Action, Inc (TIA) in the form of Agent X.

Just as some backgound here, as NES readers know, there is nothing more dangerous than an agitated public servant. They sit there at the desk twisting the end of the propelling pencil  backwards and forwards for hours, getting more and more agitated and deciding whether to WRITE A NOTE. They may event be tempted to pull out the Parker and make it a FORMAL note. That this is the only work done all day by the first secreatry, is none of our business, but the propelling pencil wins and a quick instruction is written to the second secretary reading Take Urgent Action to Stem XI and underlined by a signature which required sixteen circular motions to complete. His secrtary walks it to the next office to the already agitated secon secretary who is also a member of this site and flies [avref] or says he does an RV. Steam comes out of his ears at handing to do something, but he gets to with his Biro and pens a NOTE to the third secretary, saying "Of your ass sunshine and FIX this for once. His signature shows a slight tremble. He hands his note to his secretary (not to be confused with the "numbered" secretarys) and flicks it onto his desk. This one explodes, grabs a felt pen and writes "YOU SHOULD HAVE FIXED THIS BY NOW YOU XXXXXXX XXXX  WIPE XI OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. Spluttering, he give the note to his secretary who take it next door to the fourth secretary who looks at it, and writes "XXXX XXX I'm at lunch, who's XI?" then gives it to her.

(Well they're no longer allowed t do the last part)

Agent X..................................