Garfly Posted October 2, 2023 Posted October 2, 2023 Two killed in Lake Placid airplane crash identified | News, Sports, Jobs - Lake Placid News WWW.LAKEPLACIDNEWS.COM LAKE PLACID — The two people killed in an airplane crash at the Lake Placid Airport on Sunday have been identified as Russ Francis, a former NFL tight end who Air Safety Institute's Richard McSpadden Dies In Crash - AVweb WWW.AVWEB.COM Richard McSpadden, the senior vice president of the AOPA Air Safety Institute died, along with one other person, in the crash of a Cessna 177RG near Lake Placid Airport in upstate New York Sunday...
facthunter Posted October 2, 2023 Posted October 2, 2023 The RG Cessna's have the most drag from the gear when it's 1/2 retracted . Nev
pmccarthy Posted October 2, 2023 Posted October 2, 2023 I watched him in many videos. Now killed by the impossible turn.
onetrack Posted October 2, 2023 Posted October 2, 2023 (edited) I wouldn't be so sure it was the impossible turn. The news items state the C177RG went straight into trees off the end of the runway. The 70 yr old pilot was a skilled and passionate aviator and had owned a number of warbirds, including a P-51 and a Sea Fury. The terrain around Lake Placid airport looks rather uninviting for an emergency landing. https://www.adirondackdailyenterprise.com/news/local-news/2023/10/two-killed-in-lake-placid-airplane-crash-identified/ Edited October 2, 2023 by onetrack age correction...
RossK Posted October 4, 2023 Posted October 4, 2023 (edited) Reports of an attempted turn back “The airplane attempted to return to the airport but failed to make the runway,” the statement reads. Doesn't look to be many good options departing from Lake Placid. He was in the right seat apparently, so not PIC, but still a bit of a surprise, considering this video he did in 2021. Impossible Turn Terrible loss, his videos were always informative and I found them helpful. Edited October 4, 2023 by RossK
kgwilson Posted October 4, 2023 Posted October 4, 2023 I had to look up what a tight end is as it sounds very uncomfortable. 1
Thruster88 Posted October 4, 2023 Posted October 4, 2023 In the 2021 AOPA turn back vid there is a sound like a stall warning during the super cub turn back, the same sound can be heard during the landing, I thought it was not a good look for a safety video. The impossible turn may be impossible in some aircraft but it will only kill you if the aircraft stall/spins. The stall warning should not sound at best glide speed. Going below best glide speed is stupid.
RossK Posted October 4, 2023 Posted October 4, 2023 15 hours ago, Thruster88 said: The stall warning should not sound at best glide speed. Going below best glide speed is stupid. And this is the part that gets people killed in the impossible turn. From the vidoes I've seen online, and my own trials (with an instructor at altitude), to make the turn work, you need to bank hard (60deg angle) and keep the turn tight. Hard bank increases the load factor and the stall speed. The increase in load factor increases the stall speed pretty much to the best glide speed for most aircraft. What people forget is during the turn, you need to push the nose down to keep the airspeed up - higher than best glide speed Doing that with the prop stopped would take every ounce of your mental and physical courage to resist the urge to pull. 3 1
facthunter Posted October 4, 2023 Posted October 4, 2023 The stall warning goes off at a margin above the stall including the higher speed dynamic stall because it's the Angle of Attack that initiates it. A low rate of turn will not work best in a turn back. It takes too long. A failed engine will often still windmill but will be worse than an idling one. A CS prop may give more drag than a fixed pitch one. Obviously the turn is sometimes possible but to lose control is dire and you generally land at a higher ground speed than you are used to since you are downwind. Nev 2 2
Thruster88 Posted October 5, 2023 Posted October 5, 2023 In the AOPA vid they used 45° angle of bank, a stall speed increase of 1.2. Best glide in most light aircraft is 1.4 times clean stall speed so the stall warning should not be sounding. Regardless of why or even if the sound is a stall warning it was not a good look for a safety vid about turning back when stalling is only thing that matters. 1
facthunter Posted October 5, 2023 Posted October 5, 2023 . The Point is don't attempt a return unless you CAN do it. Everyone I know teaches land straight ahead only turning to avoid obstacles and NEVER lose control of the plane. The quicker you do commence the turn is also important as you don't go so far away. This is ALWAYS a critical manoeuvre not always impossible but frequently fatal and often initiated instinctively rather that by good decision.. It's always going to require above average skill even when it's possible. Generally, DO NOT do it. Nev 1 3
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