Rotax 912 oil filter. Reputable suppliers?

[facthunter]

Be grateful for ANY service .  There's no guarantee they will still be in business, tomorrow..  Nev

[onetrack]

Quote

 One of the most important of those is how the can is crimped onto the base. It could be done by a modern high spec machine, or a busted arsed 70 year old Soviet piece of shit in a back alley in Vietnam and they could LOOK the same to you and me. Im not a LAME or industrial engineer so I'll be paying that extra $20 ro-tax each year.

Aww, c'mon Danny - these finest quality Rotax filters are produced in our ISO 9001: 2015-graded factory, with a dedicated and highly skilled workforce!!

 

I can offer you a supply of thousands at a great price, to ensure good profits for you!! 😄

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmvTaCWx4fo

 

[facthunter]

They are Probably Better than a  lot.. Individually Pressure tested under water.. Nev

[onetrack]

Nev, automated filter manufacturing produces a consistent product with accuracy of materials being constantly checked - even to ultrasonic thickness checking of filter pleating. 

Just one of those frocked Pakistani boys having a bad day at work, is going to result in a bad batch of filters, that their minimalistic QC checking system would never pick up.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-A7nQz_H_s

 

[rgmwa]

What a soul destroying way to make a living being on a human assembly line like that and working in those conditions while the factory owner is probably doing very nicely.

[danny_galaga]

1 hour ago, onetrack said:

Aww, c'mon Danny - these finest quality Rotax filters are produced in our ISO 9001: 2015-graded factory, with a dedicated and highly skilled workforce!!

 

I can offer you a supply of thousands at a great price, to ensure good profits for you!! 😄

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmvTaCWx4fo

 

Damn, exactly as I described, except the back alley is in Pakistan!

[facthunter]

Another serious discussion ruined. Just sayin . Nev

[skippydiesel]

16 hours ago, rgmwa said:

What a soul destroying way to make a living being on a human assembly line like that and working in those conditions while the factory owner is probably doing very nicely.

I second your concerns about apparent lack OH&S & the likly near slaver wages (poor buggers).

 

As for who is "doing very nicely". I speculate; yes the factory owner but even more so the western importers/retailers - their profit margin is likely eye watering😈

17 hours ago, onetrack said:

Aww, c'mon Danny - these finest quality Rotax filters are produced in our ISO 9001: 2015-graded factory, with a dedicated and highly skilled workforce!!

 

I can offer you a supply of thousands at a great price, to ensure good profits for you!! 😄

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmvTaCWx4fo

 

I stand to be corrected;

 

The only quality concerns I would have are:

Foreign matter  - No system to prevent "stuff" being include within the canister.

Canister burst pressure - Probably adequate but how would you know for sure?

Oil filtration -

• Is the media used, appropriate for the job?
• The quantity (surface area) seemed to be along the lines of a "metric handful" ie likly to vary significantly, even with the same hand measurement.
• The media was not sealed against the internal top/bottom discs,  relying on spring pressure - completely inadequate.

I did notice some black painted filters (Rotax?)😈

[onetrack]

They may be painted to look like Rotax filters - but I'd have to opine, they're the filters that don't meet with Rotax approval.

 

Edited May 22 by onetrack

[skippydiesel]

2 hours ago, onetrack said:

They may be painted to look like Rotax filters - but I'd have to opine, they're the filters that don't meet with Rotax approval.

 

Problem is when the appearance/acurate facimily, is that of the OM product - how would you know?

 

This is where you reduce the odds, of purchasing an unknown quantity substitute,  by patronising a, hopefully, reliable supplier.

 

At the end of the day - with a product like a spin on oil filter canister - you are trusting that the internal operating parts, are as the engine manufacturer has specified. You wont have a clue, until you open the canister after service. Even then your subjective assessment may not be sufficient to determine good from bad.

 

I would much preferer replacing an oil filter element (as in both my road vehicles and one of my tractors) to the convenience of a spin on conister.

😈

 

[facthunter]

It depends on who is doing the job. More human error likely with the cartridge type. Nev

[Blueadventures]

4 hours ago, onetrack said:

They may be painted to look like Rotax filters - but I'd have to opine, they're the filters that don't meet with Rotax approval.

 

There is no way they are for Rotax to sell.  Everyone who cuts their oil filter open after changing out will know the big difference; e.g. spring method and pleat numbers, and two other components, etc.

[skippydiesel]

3 hours ago, Blueadventures said:

  Everyone who cuts their oil filter open after changing out will know the big difference; 

You just agreed with/made one of my points.

 

That's all done after you have used it for up to 100 hrs - bit late in the day my friend.

 

I guess you could do your own QA and cut open a random sample BEFORE using any of them - how many of your, near $80 oil filters,will you sacrifice ?  😈

Edited May 22 by skippydiesel

[danny_galaga]

21 hours ago, skippydiesel said:

Problem is when the appearance/acurate facimily, is that of the OM product - how would you know?

 

This is where you reduce the odds, of purchasing an unknown quantity substitute,  by patronising a, hopefully, reliable supplier.

 

At the end of the day - with a product like a spin on oil filter canister - you are trusting that the internal operating parts, are as the engine manufacturer has specified. You wont have a clue, until you open the canister after service. Even then your subjective assessment may not be sufficient to determine good from bad.

 

I would much preferer replacing an oil filter element (as in both my road vehicles and one of my tractors) to the convenience of a spin on conister.

😈

 

This is where you reduce your odds, and buy a Rotax filter from a reputable aircraft parts supplier, and not from Hellokitty99 on eBay with a 96% rating.

[facthunter]

The usual term is OEM part . Original Equipment Manufacturer.. Nev

[skippydiesel]

3 hours ago, danny_galaga said:

This is where you reduce your odds, and buy a Rotax filter from a reputable aircraft parts supplier, and not from Hellokitty99 on eBay with a 96% rating.

Yes!

 

I have heard of people purchasing  the "Tempest Oil Filter AA825706"  with built in magnet but have no personal experience

 

They are about the same price (in Astralia) as the Rotax 825-016. I very much doubt the magnet does a lot for your oil cleanliness.

 

Year ago I acquired a very strong magnet, (from a dumped security door) put it on my Daihatsu Rocky 2.8 Turbo Diesel spin on filter. When I cut open the filters, there never was any ferrous particles adhering to that part of the inner casing - no change in 750,000 kms.

 

I am fairly sure there was another reputable supplier of Rotax 912 oil filters - don't come up when I Google, so may be went out of business.

 

I did find "TLAC" in the UK £9.34- never heard of them and CP9124C CHALLENGER STAINLESS STEEL MICRONIC OIL FILTER  for $ 313 (US), between  6-11 Rotax filters.

 

😈

[danny_galaga]

27 minutes ago, skippydiesel said:

Yes!

 

I have heard of people purchasing  the "Tempest Oil Filter AA825706"  with built in magnet but have no personal experience

 

They are about the same price (in Astralia) as the Rotax 825-016. I very much doubt the magnet does a lot for your oil cleanliness.

 

Year ago I acquired a very strong magnet, (from a dumped security door) put it on my Daihatsu Rocky 2.8 Turbo Diesel spin on filter. When I cut open the filters, there never was any ferrous particles adhering to that part of the inner casing - no change in 750,000 kms.

 

I am fairly sure there was another reputable supplier of Rotax 912 oil filters - don't come up when I Google, so may be went out of business.

 

I did find "TLAC" in the UK £9.34- never heard of them and CP9124C CHALLENGER STAINLESS STEEL MICRONIC OIL FILTER  for $ 313 (US), between  6-11 Rotax filters.

 

😈

912 has a gearbox magnet, you would have noticed that does in fact pick up ferrous particles.

 

There's this small upstart called 'aircraft spruce' you could take a gamble on for your Rotax oil filter. 

[facthunter]

Magnets only Pick up Steel and iron Particles,  but in Gearboxes and cam faced shock absorbers that's a big help. Some steel Particles are very Hard. Nev

[skippydiesel]

14 hours ago, danny_galaga said:

912 has a gearbox magnet, you would have noticed that does in fact pick up ferrous particles.

 

There's this small upstart called 'aircraft spruce' you could take a gamble on for your Rotax oil filter. 

You probably didnt understand - the Tempest magnet is in the oil filter .

 

Its common for automotive transmission to have a magnet similar to the Rotax 9 instalation.

 

Aircraft Spruce are asking high prices for the Rotax OM filter. That and my resent dealings with them, over a defective product, do not encourage me to do buisness with them.😈

 

[danny_galaga]

26 minutes ago, skippydiesel said:

You probably didnt understand - the Tempest magnet is in the oil filter .

 

Its common for automotive transmission to have a magnet similar to the Rotax 9 instalation.

 

Aircraft Spruce are asking high prices for the Rotax OM filter. That and my resent dealings with them, over a defective product, do not encourage me to do buisness with them.😈

 

The problem with Google is it freezes past prices in time. What is the CURRENT cheapest price you've found for the Rotax filter, from a supplier you can trust?

 

Funnily enough, I bought one earlier this year and can't remember who I bought it off and how much 😄

Edited May 23 by danny_galaga

[skippydiesel]

20 minutes ago, danny_galaga said:

Funnily enough, I bought one earlier this year and can't remember who I bought it off and how much 😄

General Observation;

 

These days a lot of suppliers advertise at a low purchase cost, only to jack up/inflate delivery charges.

 

If you have other Rotax 9 users in your vicinity/airfield, I suggest purchasing as a group, to minimise the cost of delivery/unit and if really lucky, negotiate a bulk purchase price.😈

[facthunter]

Sludge and fine particles can centrifuge into any rotating parts where oil flows and settle in oilways and the Bottom of oil tanks and sumps. Filtration to only 40 Microns doesn't get the Particles fine enough to stop Wear. Improved filtration is one of the reasons Later Motors go far further than they Used to. Collected sludge can always dislodge  and block off oil supply or cause a Lifter to not Pump Up with significant Power Loss.. When you rebuild a Motor it's  important to remove ALL sludge anywhere in the Motor. NEW motors can have Metal Swarf,  Hone grit, or Lint from the wrong rags used when assembling. You also need a dust free area with clean compressed air to Blowout blind threads, oilways. and fuel lines. etc  Pre-pressure ALL engines after repair or Long term storage to ensure no dry start .Nev

[danny_galaga]

3 hours ago, facthunter said:

Sludge and fine particles can centrifuge into any rotating parts where oil flows and settle in oilways and the Bottom of oil tanks and sumps. Filtration to only 40 Microns doesn't get the Particles fine enough to stop Wear. Improved filtration is one of the reasons Later Motors go far further than they Used to. Collected sludge can always dislodge  and block off oil supply or cause a Lifter to not Pump Up with significant Power Loss.. When you rebuild a Motor it's  important to remove ALL sludge anywhere in the Motor. NEW motors can have Metal Swarf,  Hone grit, or Lint from the wrong rags used when assembling. You also need a dust free area with clean compressed air to Blowout blind threads, oilways. and fuel lines. etc  Pre-pressure ALL engines after repair or Long term storage to ensure no dry start .Nev

One good thing about the Rotax 912 is that because it's a dry sump, you hand rotate the prop to 'burp' it. Crankcase pressure pushes what little oil there is in the case and return line into the oil tank. The upshot of this is every time you check the oil, you've prelubed and pressurised the oil somewhat. Just from hand spinning half a dozen times the oil pressure gauge shows pressure.

 

Dry sump is a pain in the arse when it comes to oil changes, but I like the fact you've ipso facto prelubed it each morning 🙂

[Blueadventures]

3 hours ago, facthunter said:

Sludge and fine particles can centrifuge into any rotating parts where oil flows and settle in oilways and the Bottom of oil tanks and sumps. Filtration to only 40 Microns doesn't get the Particles fine enough to stop Wear. Improved filtration is one of the reasons Later Motors go far further than they Used to. Collected sludge can always dislodge  and block off oil supply or cause a Lifter to not Pump Up with significant Power Loss.. When you rebuild a Motor it's  important to remove ALL sludge anywhere in the Motor. NEW motors can have Metal Swarf,  Hone grit, or Lint from the wrong rags used when assembling. You also need a dust free area with clean compressed air to Blowout blind threads, oilways. and fuel lines. etc  Pre-pressure ALL engines after repair or Long term storage to ensure no dry start .Nev

Heavy sludge collects and pretty much remains at the bottom of the oil can below the plate at the bottom of the mesh filter screen.  That's also why it's important to disassemble the can and clean it.  Running avgas creates more sludge buildup.  The sludge remains even after draining the oil via the bottom plug, as its very thick.

Edited Sunday at 11:23 AM by Blueadventures

[skippydiesel]

12 hours ago, Blueadventures said:

Heavy sludge collects and pretty much remains at the bottom of the oil can below the plate at the bottom of the mesh filter screen.  That's also why it's important to disassemble the can and clean it.  Running avgas creates more sludge buildup.  The sludge remains even after draining the oil via the bottom plug, as its very thick.

In over 10 years & 950 hrs of operation (almost no AvGas) my last 912ULS never had any "sludge"  in the oil tank. 

 

In my early, amature, automotive, mechanic days, it was not unusual to have sludge in engines - no longer the case. I put this down to the use of high detergent oils and better engine temperature control.😈

Edited Sunday at 11:40 PM by skippydiesel