skippydiesel

4 hours ago, turboplanner said:

Because there is a new group of players. You would know the details are not advertised.

Turb's me old mate - If there are so many boggy men out there;

• How come the AFP (or whomsoever Gov security persons) are not actively checking out these, often remote ,Security Controlled Airfields (SCA)?
• How come so many of the security fences /gates can be circumnavigated/breached by any member of he public who cares to do so?
• How come busy airfields (without RPT/non SCA)  with  hundreds of aircraft, from twin turbo props, down to light sport aircraft, can be accessed by members of the public, without an ASIC, any sign of security?
• How come so many ASIC holders tell the same story of never having been asked for their ASIC/challenged at a SCA?

Face it the ASIC is a joke has no beneficial effect on Australian security and as such  is an affront to the ideals of a democracy - its a law for the sake of making a law.

Yes I can confirm -

Exit/Entry to The Sydney Basin - North, East (Pacific Ocean) and West, has considerable risks. To the South there is relatively less risk, due to some open (cleared) country before getting to open Monaro grazing country

My practise has always been to fly at the maximum altitude consistent, with ATC limits. In practise this may be as low as 500ft AMSL (Victor1)  and as high as , cruise climb to, 7500 ft  (about 3000ft above terrain) despite this the "pucker" factor is very present and real or imagined engine note changes, gets the heart rate up very quickly.

I only mention this to show that, at times, the training we receive, not to cross "Tiger Country" (which in my mind includes large swathes of urban/city development) is rendered impractical, that is if you fly in/out of The Sydney Basin.

Wedderburn/Napper airfield is one of only two (3 if you count Mittagong) unrestricted airfields close to Sydney - its location, within a forest,  is regrettable but if you want to have your aircraft relatively close by, compromise on this safety challenge is your only option (like flying in/out of the Basin).

Ironpot,

You did not address your comment(s) to me however I assume that they were so directed.

I, like many pilots,  influenced by the prevailing propaganda at the time, applied for ASIC when it first came out . Received my ASIC (& renewed 2 years later).  I now consider my action to be as hasty/foolish as the Governments. In all the time I held my ASIC, not once was I asked for it (a very common story) nor did I see any practical enhancement to security at airfields (the fences/gates are not an effective barrier to those bent on criminal acts). Small airfield are pretty much as secure today, as they were before ASIC came into effect.

Flying is costly, the financial cost of the ASIC, is, in the scheme of things ,almost nothing. That a human Government caught up in the moment, made an error is understandable. That subsequent Government(s) of the day, have not rescinded this (& other bad laws) is unforgivable.

We (the public) have never received "free" services from our Government/bureaucracy. ALL services are payed for directly/indirectly and always have been. ALL costs are passed on to the proletariat sooner or later. To think otherwise is naive. The requirement that airfield owners must comply, with ASIC, assonated security upgrades,  has a financial cost (on going). To imagine that these costs will not be on passed on to the public (& pilots) where ever possible is also naive.

"Dealing with fuel, blasting, tow-trucks etc etc all require some sort of security clearance Yeh! So? People handling dangerous goods/engaged in dangerous services  (do tow truck drivers really need a security pass?) must be trained in minimising the risks to the public/infrastructure. You & I as pilots have also been trained in minimising risk,  in our field and we do a BFR to keep us up to speed. Due to crimes against our children, people working with them, require security screening - great! BUT how many private pilots have actually taken their sport aircraft and done harm to the people? Commercial pilots are something else - its rare but it does happen, that a suicidal pilots takes a plane load of people with them.  How does ASIC and a few chain link fences actually prevent the mentally disturbed/politically motivated (same thing?) committing a crime, especially when its  not policed in any meaningful way?

All laws have an impact on our freedom/democracy -  in a complex society there must be some restrictions to antisocial behaviours. This is called compromise BUT laws that are ineffectual, not based on factual research (logic), etc are just bad and should not be tolerated, even it only effects a few privileged person (pilot)s. 

All of us (not just pilots) should be alert to any diminution of our democratic system (good men..........)

10 minutes ago, turboplanner said:

You're not related to Neville Chamberlain are you Skippy?

 

Was Chamberlain not the advocate of Nazi appeasement ? possibly a good man )

2 minutes ago, jackc said:

Skippy, I am a good man….WHAT do you want me to do? 

Raise your voice at every opportunity -  If you actually believe you live in a democracy - its your right & duty. 

As an individual you may as well shout into the wind (deliberate mix quote). As a group we may have some impact. As members of an organisation (RAA's) we might just elicited a more proactive stance (I live in hope - such is the burden for the incurable optimist) )

ASIC is but a symptom.

Two truism's:

• Democracy is a fragile.
• The only thing necessary for evil to triumph in the world is that good men do nothing

Those that advocate (no doubt all good men). just rolling over and accepting ASIC, as another minor inconvenience, don't understand just how fragile our democratic system is. Australians are famous for ignoring unworkable/illogical/petty rules but I suggest this blase attitude is very wrong, as it allows our rulers to enact bad legislation (such as ASIC) that just sits there, festering away, waiting for some poor innocent sod to have the book thrown at them. 

Any law that is current (ie not rescinded) can be used against you. If charged, at the very least will be inconvenient, may involve considerable cost and if found guilty, by an unsympathetic judge, may see you loose your license/certificate/ ability to travel overseas/ liberty (what are the penalties for ASIC non compliance?). 

If we do live in/under a truly democratic system, I would suggest that all laws pass the following simple test;

• Protect the majority from the minority.
• Protect the minority from the majority.

(ASIC fails to address both)

Simplistic? Yes and will not quite cover every potential scenario, that the Gov must address BUT where this test can not used, extraordinary rigour must be applied to all aspect of the legislation BEFOR it is passed (no knee jerk populist crap) All such legislation must have a "sunset" clause requiring comprehensive review before reinstating. 

ASIC (& its like) are an affront to every private (small aircraft) pilots democratic rights. Its a cost we (& the public) should not have to bear. If you think the cost minor (pilot application fees), you forget all the RPT airfield owners being forced to install (often totally ineffective) security systems the cost of which will inevitably be passed on to the public (flying or not).

ASIC  (as applied to private pilots using minor airfields) is just indefensible/stupid, has no sunset clause and because the private flying community has little if any political leverage, likely to continue on indefinitely. In saying this I do not for one moment suggest we should accept or not take every opportunity to appose this bad legislation.

On 31/12/2022 at 5:37 PM, jackc said:

Well it’s simple…..WANT the card?  NEED the card? Just suck it up and get it……many things in Aviation are a crock, just add ASIC Card to the pile 🙂  

Mutton!

1 hour ago, Ironpot said:

I know most of you know this already but for the benefit of new pilots and students who simply pop in here for information:-

 

An ASIC is nothing to be worried about - it's not a big deal................................................................

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In summary, it's just not a big deal. You can plan around it, if you so wish,  and even if you don’t have an ASIC, a little bit of decorum and simple common-sense will get you through everything except the major airports.

 

No offence intended Ironpot but I cant believe that any pilot (operating outside the major airports) would accept the undermining of our liberty, for absolutely no tangible improvement in Australian security -ASIC was a knee jerk reaction to an overseas event (sort of understandable given the standard of so many of our leaders) that should have been abolished at the earliest opportunity (is it 12 years ago?)

ASIC is a sick & inconvenient joke, that has the potential to cause harm. Consider the possibility; that a pilot without ASIC, unwilling to land at a Security Controlee Airfield, continues on, in the hope of reaching a less hostile destination, running out of fuel and possibly dying. This may be a stretch of the imagination but people make all sorts of decisions based on fear of prosecution, etc.

I have yet to see any rational argument for the retention of ASIC on minor airfields (even if they have two RPTS a week/day/month or non any more)

Taking (accepting) ASIC in the first instance is a step way to far!

1 hour ago, RFguy said:

 

"Seems I have a flooding/overflowing float chamber - will investigate tomorrow."
Skippy -  Be very mindful of a fire hazard .  I know you know this but worthwhile  highlighting. Am pleased to see your overflow goes somewhere instead of just into a tray under the carb....

Skip do you have a fuel tank return in the setup ? another thing to .....

Yes,  to the return line - due to an unusual fuel tank(s) configuration, I am a bit concerned about the amount (too much)of fuel the return delivers. Another niggle that will be addressed in due course. The niggle list doesn't seem to get any shorter - par for the course?

Reporting in after .9 hr test flight -

Before TO, checked fuel pressure sensor has a small (about 1.5mm) hole in casing, to atmosphere - appeared to be clear.

After leveling out

Turned boost pump off, fuel pressure dropped to below 2 psi  - fuel pressure then returned to 4.5 psi & stayed there. This suggests to me that the pressure sensor may be taking time to "catch" up with change in air pressure.

(FYI - Rotax Forum - seems quite a few pilots have the same/similar problem and never find the exact cause - most just live with it)

After landing

Noted fuel pressure at 3500 rpm, about 4.5 -5psi

After shut down

Checked sample bottle on end of air box breather - about 15ml fuel. Seem I have a flooding/overflowing float chamber - will investigate tomorrow.

Checked sample bottle end of pump drain - bit hard to see but might be empty  - will investigate tomorrow.

6 minutes ago, Blueadventures said:

Thanks just confirming detail.  Pump seal and diaphragm should be good then.

yes - but I have already had to replace the starter motor under warranty, so no guarantees that the fuel pump is okay.

2 hours ago, IBob said:

I see that, Bluedaventures and it does need investigating.
But we need more info:
Is this a bottle just for the fuel pump vent, or is it also for oil reservoir vent. If so, which is the oil coming from?
Also, is oil still coming?
 

I was taught to troubleshoot by formulating a theory, based on my understanding of the machine,  that matched the symptoms...then formulating tests to test the theory. And doing all that before actually picking up any tools.
In Skippy's case here, I am very interested to know more precisely when the problem appears and also to what degree. Does it appear immediately on takeoff, or does it increase with altitude?

 

I have also learnt to simplify wherever possible: remove extraneous stuff rather than adding to it, in order to focus on one specific thing.

First - I hope I can go for a test fight later today so that I might be able to be a tad more precise in describing some of the symptoms.

Second - Bottles/catch can- I had ( past tense) two bottles - one for engine oil breather and one for fuel pump/carburettor air box. The oil (I assume no fuel but hard to be definite) was caught in the fuel pump/air box bottle. I have now separated all into 3 small bottles but have yet to fly.

1 hour ago, Blueadventures said:

Be helpful to know the engine history; year built, TTIS, hours since last run if not new etc  Cheers.

As stated - new - 11 hrs split fairly evenly between flight & ground test.

Engine purchased new late 2019 - first run earlier this year.

Good stuff gents - will check out the pressure sensor tomorrow .

Not sure if its relevant but there was a small amount of engine oil in the-fuel pump drain bottle - may be 2-5 ml

Aircraft; New Sonex, with new Rotax 912ULS. Dynon Skyview engine instruments.

Mystery;

Fuel pressure with & without boost pump, meets Rotax fuel pressure standards, while ground running, taxi run up etc. Fuel pressure drops (Dynon alarms), during climb out (when boost turned off) and must be maintained with boost pump on for duration of flight. Pressure returns on landing. Engine has never shown signs of fuel starvation (loss of power/hesitator, etc).

Have checked & rechecked:

• Fuel sensor security  (attached to firewall)-appears to be okay.
• Gascolator screen for contamination - all good
• Aircraft has two wings tanks - makes no difference which one is in use.

Wondering;

Faulty sensor reading but why only in flight?

If cowling air pressure  (through drain hose) could be influencing the pump diaphragm.

Ideas?

2 hours ago, facthunter said:

To the question asked of me on ext Power, the light indicates power available. Ideally you then select EXT,  OR it could use it's own  dedicated relay in the plane to do it automatically which is less safe. This removes the need to remove the cowl for charging or powering electrics when servicing.  or jump starting. DANGEROUS.  Nev

To the best of my, admittedly limited, knowledge all relays require power. If your battery is dead you wont be able to activate the external power plug to allow for charging  or jump start.  This is why I have my external power in/out as the only circuit that does not go through the master switch. Yes this is an additional risk which I have sought to minimise by oversupplying the system.

Does "DANGEROUS" refer to the prop alone? or are there other issues? covered by this statement.

3 hours ago, facthunter said:

Re the Plug for ext power. It needn't be live to the ext power is connected. Automatic relay with light in the cockpit when energised.    Nev

So if battery dead, relays not working, how do you charge/boost your battery without removing the cowl?

Onetrack - Thanks for that, Clearly  I erred however I am fairly sure that the chemical resistant ones are not available in Australia. I tried to find them and every supplier said not available. I purchased my plugs from JayCar - I assume they are origional. I tool two back & they replaced them,  after I accidently splashed them with petrol & they just cracked through, all over.

I dont see any refence to your "P" chemical resistant designation in the information you have provided. Do you know of an Australian supplier of the P type?

6 minutes ago, Blueadventures said:

Actually zero as put through a Mr Funnel.

I hope your Mr Funnel sits more securely than mine - very easy to tip and the pouring action leaves the stream of fuel vulnerable to wind gust spillage.

Mr Funnel's do not have a sealing top/bottom cap - potential for fuel contamination is much increased.

7 minutes ago, facthunter said:

Very selective analysis. No one has mentioned JUGS. Any bad occurrence is very manageable and if you take the required time, very safe.  etc etc implies WHAT? . A PROPER 10L container is weight manageable and safe especially if capped. No weight is put on the top of the wing structure.  You'd have to be asleep to cause an overflow..   Nev

Sorry - I used jugs as a generic container thought bubble 

As for implication - if it suits your operation - good on yah! It would not suit mine. Not only would I not want to carry multiple 10L containers (having 10 x 20L is more than enough) or the alternative make 10 fill, transfer to aircraft, decant procedures. More fill/decant cycles must expose the fuel to higher risk of contamination & spillage - its just the number of repetitions. Is the 10L person going to securely cap his container every repetition?, is his focus going to be absolute when poring? so preventing spillage - is he human?

My consistent idea/suggestion is to get away from the physical effort of lifting heavy containers (or multiple smaller ones) - I can manage 2x20L lifted from the ground & walk with straight arms, quite easily - lifting above this has become problematic, hence the desirability of an effective pumping system that avoids the  lift/decant action. I think I have it - it would be nice to be able to purchase a quality of the shelf unit (with all the safety features in place) but I have yet to find one.

47 minutes ago, RFguy said:

not many options for EFATO at Wedderburn.... (not saying this was any cause) .

I would say almost nil - about 1.5 km of bush to the nearest open country. Loss of power on TO would have left the pilot with few options.

1 hour ago, facthunter said:

Has anybody progressed the idea of an external power socket?  Could come in useful for a few things  like jump starting from a large battery and conserving yours for flight..  Nev

Yes  -My aircraft is fitted with an Anderson plug direct to battery. Its the only circuit not isolated by the master switch, so can be used for battery boost/charge and as a source of power. The Anderson is accessed through the top cowl inspection door. When not in use is red Velcro'd securely the underlying engine components and has a rubber cap reducing the chance of inadvertent terminal contact..

Note:

• The grey Anderson plugs are not hydrocarbon safe, even a small petrol spill will cause them to disintegrate. The red Anderson plugs are chemical resistant BUT not available in Australia.
• Having a "live" circuit is an added risk - take this into consideration when deciding to install - use high quality insulated wire & connector's rated above the highest expected load.

1 hour ago, Blueadventures said:

110 litres.

So, potentially 10 X 10 litre jugs of fuel (allowing that you may have run down to reserve, depending on engine). That's 10 opportunities to have an accident, allow for fuel contamination, etc et.c

1 hour ago, Blueadventures said:

My 12 volt fuel setup mounted on an old laundry trolley is used at my home hangar to ease all my refuelling.  It draws power from either the aircraft or a battery I have on solar charge that is on a small trolley truck and used also if anyone has a flat battery on aircraft or car.

 

In the field I like the 10 liter at a time to refuel and have a small folding step in the aircraft that doubles as a seat to get a bit higher up to pour the fuel in via a Mr Funnel that is carried onboard.

 

10 liters in the container allows better control of the pour at arms length.  Also consider the wind direction so no spill / splash is carried onto the windscreens, as pouring mogas.

 

Cheers

What is your aircrafts fuel capacity?