Allen B Posted July 6 Posted July 6 Good morning/afternoon. I own and fly a 601HDS. Has anyone successfully designed and built flaps for the Zenith 601HDS. I find my HDS has a reasonably high stall speed and as such is not a pussycat to land. Regards Allen B.
facthunter Posted July 6 Posted July 6 I can't imagine that would be a simple Mod. There are all sorts of structural implications. Are you doing powered approaches with accurate speed control? Do you regularly sideslip? Nev
dlegg Posted July 6 Posted July 6 You could make/acquire HD wings and swap out the speed wings for slower stall speed. No flaps as far as I know. 1
Allen B Posted July 6 Author Posted July 6 Hi Nev and thank you for your prompt reply. Regarding the approach, I have tried various approaches and despite having a couple of thousand hours and flown a number of different aircraft, I find this small aircraft more challenging than any other that I have previously flown. I suspect the rather high stall speed (a bit tricky to replicate and pinpoint the exact stall speed) of anywhere from mid to late 40's knots, requires a fairly flat approach over the fence when landing. I feel if it had flaps, it would allow for the nose of the aircraft to maintain a higher attitude while the airspeed could be a bit less over the fence. I acknowledge the full length ailerons would create a challenge to convert, to shorten the ailerons and utilise the inboard section/length of the existing ailerons to become flaps. So I just thought I would ask if this mod has already been done somewhere out there in Zenith land ?. Allen B. 1
Allen B Posted July 6 Author Posted July 6 7 minutes ago, dlegg said: You could make/acquire HD wings and swap out the speed wings for slower stall speed. No flaps as far as I know. Thanks for this suggestion Diegg, however I do like the Tapered HDS wing, but less of a challenge for the landing would be nice... (just wishful thinking I suppose) Allen B 1
RossK Posted July 6 Posted July 6 16 minutes ago, Allen B said: Thanks for this suggestion Diegg, however I do like the Tapered HDS wing, but less of a challenge for the landing would be nice... (just wishful thinking I suppose) Allen B Could you convert the airlerons into flaperons like the RV-12? 1 1
Kiwi Posted July 6 Posted July 6 In my Drifter if you adjust the airlerons down a few degrees it lowers the stall speed (and the cruise speed) on your aircraft are Ailerons set correctly? Have you thought about adding VG's ? 1 1
facthunter Posted July 6 Posted July 6 Flaperons Have their Own control aspects/problems. You need more drag to come in steeper. Flaps of the Lifting kind will give you a Lower nose attitude on approach AND Lower the stall speed. What do you consider a SAFE approach speed in normal conditions? Is your engine's idle speed a bit high? Get it too slow, and you introduce another Problem. Does it drop a wing when stalling? Nev
cherk Posted July 6 Posted July 6 My 2cents .............Stolspeed vortex generators and Gurney flaps ! ☺️
Allen B Posted July 6 Author Posted July 6 4 hours ago, RossK said: Could you convert the airlerons into flaperons like the RV-12? Thanks for this suggestion however from my small experience with flying the RV-12 shows (at least to me) Flaperons isn't the way to go either. But thank you for your suggestion. Allen B
cherk Posted July 6 Posted July 6 On the Stolspeed site , there is a swiss CH601 HDS with details of his VG instillation , in the instal section. Worth a check . 🙂
Allen B Posted July 6 Author Posted July 6 1 hour ago, facthunter said: Flaperons Have their Own control aspects/problems. You need more drag to come in steeper. Flaps of the Lifting kind will give you a Lower nose attitude on approach AND Lower the stall speed. What do you consider a SAFE approach speed in normal conditions? Is your engine's idle speed a bit high? Get it too slow, and you introduce another Problem. Does it drop a wing when stalling? Nev Hi Nev. I agree that Flaperons is not the way to go. Idle RPM (Rotax 914) is around 1,700, so all good there. I have tested with many stalls (at between 2,000 to 3,000 feet) and the actual stall is quite gentle, with considerable buffeting but doesn't really drop a wing of a serious nature. 1
Allen B Posted July 6 Author Posted July 6 2 minutes ago, cherk said: On the Stolspeed site , there is a swiss CH601 HDS with details of his VG instillation , in the instal section. Worth a check . 🙂 I have bought the VG which I will attach soon and see what difference they make. I know about the Swiss pilot (Victor) and will follow his suggestion re placement of the VG's. I suspect the VG's may help a touch but I also suspect VG's wont perform as well as a decent set of flaps. Again, maybe it's just wishful thinking by me ?. Allen B
Allen B Posted July 6 Author Posted July 6 Just now, Allen B said: I have bought the VG's (enough for the wings and the underside of the stabiliser) which I will attach soon and see what difference they make. I know about the Swiss pilot (Victor) and will follow his suggestion re placement of the VG's. I suspect the VG's may help a touch but I also suspect VG's wont perform as well as a decent set of flaps. Again, maybe it's just wishful thinking by me ?. Allen B
Allen B Posted July 6 Author Posted July 6 23 minutes ago, cherk said: My 2cents .............Stolspeed vortex generators and Gurney flaps ! ☺️ Sorry for my ignorance but what is/are "Gurney Flaps" ? Allen B
cherk Posted July 6 Posted July 6 Dan Gurney of Indi 500 fame came up with the concept ! On the HDS wing it would be a 20mm x20mm angle on the trailing edge of the ailerons . Lots of references via our friend GOOGLE . 😆
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